
-------- TML Message #399 --------

Archive-Message-Number: 399
Date: Thu, 22 Jun 89 15:40:12 -0500
From: uxc.cso.uiuc.edu!zephyr.ENS.TEK.COM!gslisa!gsliss!jcunning@tektronix.TEK.COM
Subject: miniatures & nuclear war


[I edited this message to fix some nasty terminal escape sequences that
appeared.  I try to avoid editing since I believe in free speech, but I
don't want 150-character lines of garbage going out if I can stop it.
- -- James]

Martian Metals, which burned down in 1982 or 83 and the remnants of
which are now part of FASA, made a whole series of Traveller figures
from Aslan to Zhodani. You might try some of the more obscure distributors
in the business (notably Lou Zohichi (or however you spell that)),but
expect to pay a good buck.

As far as nuclear missiles go, a few sources come to mind: !.  Special
Supplement 2, published in Journal 18(?) should help explain that.
Striker, if you can get a copy, goes into extensive detail on the
subject of interfacing ground and ship combat.  Striker is out of print,
but last I heard GDW still has some copies around the warehouse but no
boxes for them.  They were willing to sell them last I heard.  Write
them for details.

3. See The Referee's Companion for more info.


As I don't have access to these materials as I type, I'm not certain
about the above, and as Mike said, graduate studies don't allow much
time for Traveller any more.  God knows if I'll ever get to finishing,
if ever.  Sigh.


					Jim Cunningham
					Traveller Relic

The Traveller Mailing List is a courtesy of James Perkins and Tektronix, Inc.
All opinions and material above is the responsibility of the originator.
Send Submissions To: @RELAY.CS.NET:traveller@dadla.LA.TEK.COM,
	uunet!dadla.la.tek.com!traveller, or traveller@dadla.la.tek.com
List Administrator: traveller-request@dadla.la.tek.com

-------- TML Message #400 --------

Archive-Message-Number: 400
Date: Fri, 23 Jun 89 09:17:35 -0400
From: zephyr.ENS.TEK.COM!uunet.uu.net!zephyr.ENS.TEK.COM!att!ihlpf!zonker@tektronix.TEK.COM
Subject: Miniatures


Currently I don't think anyone is actively manufactureing 15mm space
figures.  The five lines I know of are all out of production.  The lines
are:
		Citadel
		Grenadier
		Laserburn
		Martian Metals		
		Star????

The best Traveller figures were the Citadel ones (this was the licensed
line for England).  It had limited availability in this country after
Martian Metals burned and were withdrawn from production due to the American
license company (which never actually produced figures).  They produced
packs of 20 different figures each of: Adventurers, Military (you could also
get low, mid and high tech packs), Ship's Crew, Aliens (you could also get
Aslan, Droyne and Vargyr packs).  Figures were very well animated and
detailed.  These were actually produced in Canada by RAFM and so even after
they were withdrawn from sale here they were available without too much effort.
Grenadier figures while not specificially for Traveller made a number of usable
figures (including my nefarious Thought Police with police van).
Laserburn was again not for Traveller, but made numerous useful figures.  I use
a number of these for my vehicle crews and adventurers.  The figure were
also animated, but may of the figures were just too odd.
Martian Metals were the worst line quality wise.  Most of their figures looked
to me like squashed bugs.  The typical pose was standing arms straight out to
the side.  Nevertheless they had some useful figures.  They were the only ones
to produce Kirur and Zhodani figures.  They also made an "Alien" and Darth
Vader figure.  They had some decent robots.
The last line I only saw once and can't remember the whole name.  It had good
figures, but they were a bit large.  Also the line was pretty limited only a
few figures (maybe 20).
Other sources of figures that we have used include WWII 15mm figures painted
to look space age and there was a 25mm line that produced a good 15mm
lizardman (Frank Chadwick's infamous Newt Company).

					Non Cuniculus Est,
					    	Tom Harris

The Traveller Mailing List is a courtesy of James Perkins and Tektronix, Inc.
All opinions and material above is the responsibility of the originator.
Send Submissions To: @RELAY.CS.NET:traveller@dadla.LA.TEK.COM,
	uunet!dadla.la.tek.com!traveller, or traveller@dadla.la.tek.com
List Administrator: traveller-request@dadla.la.tek.com

-------- TML Message #401 --------

Archive-Message-Number: 401
Subject: Happy Second Birthday TML!
Date: 23 Jun 89 13:14:31 PDT (Fri)
From: jamesp



Friday marked the second anniversary of the Traveller Mailing List.  Two
years ago I asked rec.games.frp if such an idea raised any interest, and
now we're over 150 members strong, with the following confirmed
international membership counts: 7 in Canada, 2 in Denmark, 1 in the
Netherlands, 4 in Sweden, and 5 in the UK (about 15% of the list
membership).  We have at least 4 people on this list which have
published Traveller materials, and at least one which has run a PBEM
Traveller game.

List contributions by month (yes, the graph is sideways):

  Jun88 12 |====********
  Jul   13 |==***********
  Aug    3 |***					 ________________
M Sep    3 |***					|Legend:	 |
O Oct   11 |=**********				|Administrator = |
N Nov    8 |=*******				|Listee        * |
T Dec    2 |**					|________________|
H Jan89  3 |==*
  Feb    9 |*********
  Mar   73 |======************************************************** ~ *****
  Apr   54 |====**************************************************
  May   52 |==**************************************************
           +----+----+----+----+----+----+----+----+----+----+----+- ~ -+----+
	   0    5   10   15   20   25   30   35   40   45   50   55    70   75
		Number of messages submitted

	Note: The list mailing software was broken Jan '89 through Feb
	'89.  Jun '89 is currently at about 18 messages, so it looks
	like things have mostly calmed down.

Archives:
	Kbytes: 1717 (1140 this year)
	Number of messages: 400 (259 this year)
	Number of full bundles: 38 (26 this year)
	Average message size: 4 Kbytes
	Average # messages/week: 7 (up from 3 the previous year)

The above shows that list traffic has increased by a factor of ~2 over
the previous year.  Although messages have remained the same size, we
are getting twice as many of them.

We've had quite a loss of old listees (~30-40) in the past year, which
has been compensated by about 60 new listees, so I think the membership
is fairly stable at around 150 members.  Reasons for loss included
computer account termination (~25%), lack of interest (~25%), or broken
mail addresses (~50%).

During the past year we've had problems with duplicated mail and the
hp.com server failure, both of which have required signifigant efforts
to track down.

I've implemented a dual distribution path for list members in the past
year.  Listees can now choose between "instant" message delivery, or
twice-weekly "digest" delivery.  I've added software that makes it
easier for me to manage the list, particularly in answering standard
questions (archive requests, and the new listee package).  I've also
added "archive packages" that contain messages which pertain to specific
topics (MT Errata, Software, and Ship Designs).  If you'd like a copy of
the archive contents listing, or change your delivery format, please let
me know.

My friends at Computer Network Services here at Tek have recently put
the company mail server (tektronix.tek.com) on the Internet, with a
leased line connection to CSNET.  This has reduced propagation delay for
mail reaching you from 1-6 hours down to 1-10 minutes!

THERE WILL BE SOME CHANGES in the next couple months FOR ADDRESSING MAIL
TO REACH ME AND THE LIST DISTRIBUTION SOFTWARE.  Keep a watch out for
the change, which I will announce as it happens.

If you can think of any way to make this list better, I'd like to hear
your suggestions (even if they are "be more prompt!", or "stop sending
this silly anniversary drivel").

Thanks everybody for being a part of this list.  It's your contributions
that have made this list valuable.  Keep up the excellent quality of
this last year's contributions, and I'll try to keep the list
functional.

James

P.S.  Watch your hobby shops for the successors to Digest Group
Publications' Grand Census and Grand Survey, updated for MegaTraveller.
They are due any time.  Also in November, GDW has scheduled the release
of a "Robots" book for MegaTraveller.

- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
James T. Perkins		    Traveller Mailing List Administrator
Tektronix Digital Systems Division	     "Load Auto/Evade, Beowulf!"
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
INTERNET: traveller-request@dadla.la.tek.com
UUCP:	  {uunet,decvax}!tektronix!dadla.la.tek.com!traveller-request

The Traveller Mailing List is a courtesy of James Perkins and Tektronix, Inc.
All opinions and material above is the responsibility of the originator.
Send Submissions To: @RELAY.CS.NET:traveller@dadla.LA.TEK.COM,
	uunet!dadla.la.tek.com!traveller, or traveller@dadla.la.tek.com
List Administrator: traveller-request@dadla.la.tek.com

-------- TML Message #402 --------

Archive-Message-Number: 402
Subject: Re: Nuclear Warfare in Space
Date: Sun, 25 Jun 89 00:20:21 PDT
From: (Leonard Erickson) sun.COM!nosun.West!zephyr.ENS.TEK.COM!bucket!leonard@tektronix.TEK.COM


Bob Mahoney writes:
>Adrian Hurt asks:
>
>>Next, a more Traveller-based question. Given all the current fears about what
>>a nuclear war would do (e.g. nuclear winter), could a naval force, e.g. a
>>battle squadron, effectively destroy a planet by using a few salvoes of
>>nuclear missiles? If so, is this accounted for in any account of the Frontier
>>Wars or any other wars? Is it provided for in any rules?
>
>In the latest issue of _Challenge_, there is a "courier" senario, in which a
>number of background/flavor elements are included.  One of these mentions that
>Lucan has ordered his admirals not to surrender any High Population worlds.
>
>There is a later mention of an admiral ordering the nuclear bobmardment of a
>world he was about to lose to advancing forces, in order to change the world's
>status so that it was *no longer* a High Population world...  He is awarded the
>"Starburst for Extreme Heroism" by Lucan.   (*Nice* people!)

You don't need any nukes. Just a few starships or system defense boats. dock
them to a small asteroid (say a chunk of nickel iron a couple of kilometers
across). Use their power plants to nudge it into an orbit that will hit the
planet. Preferably in an ocean if the planet is reasonably earthlike.

Can you say "Dinosaur killer"? For that matter since the asteroid is only
going to hit at 10-15 km/sec and the impact energy depends on the *square*
of the velocity, maybe throwing a smaller asteroid at a higher speed would
be better. 6 G for a few days will give a velocity in the *thousands* of 
km/sec! (5e3 km/sec day 1, 10e3 day 2, etc...) At these speeds, who needs
a warhead? Anything short of anti-matter won't even affect the outcome!

If anyone is interested, I'll dig out the figures from an old article
on giant meteor strikes and convert the data to ship impacts on planets.


The Traveller Mailing List is a courtesy of James Perkins and Tektronix, Inc.
All opinions and material above is the responsibility of the originator.
Send Submissions To: @RELAY.CS.NET:traveller@dadla.LA.TEK.COM,
	uunet!dadla.la.tek.com!traveller, or traveller@dadla.la.tek.com
List Administrator: traveller-request@dadla.la.tek.com

-------- TML Message #403 --------

Archive-Message-Number: 403
From: (Adrian Hurt) adrian%cs.heriot-watt.ac.uk@nsfnet-relay.ac.uk
Subject: Re: Nuclear Warfare in Space
Date: Mon, 26 Jun 89 9:53:57 BST



> Can you say "Dinosaur killer"? For that matter since the asteroid is only
> going to hit at 10-15 km/sec and the impact energy depends on the *square*
> of the velocity, maybe throwing a smaller asteroid at a higher speed would
> be better. 6 G for a few days will give a velocity in the *thousands* of 
> km/sec! (5e3 km/sec day 1, 10e3 day 2, etc...) At these speeds, who needs
> a warhead? Anything short of anti-matter won't even affect the outcome!

I've thought along similar lines as well. Find a small asteroid (say, a few
100's of tonnes). Attach a power plant, manoeuvre drive and control system to
it. Move it out of orbit, to a suitable distance, and let it head for the
target world for 4 weeks at 1G (keep the drives cheap, simple and expendable).
Resulting velocity = 10 x 4 x 7 x 24 x 60 x 60 = 0.24e8 m/sec. I'll let
someone else add in any relativistic calculations. But the gear needed could be
stuffed into an empty 50 tonne weapon bay on a cruiser.
 
> If anyone is interested, I'll dig out the figures from an old article
> on giant meteor strikes and convert the data to ship impacts on planets.

Yes, dig them out, and let's zap Capital! :-)

 "Keyboard? How quaint!" - M. Scott

 Adrian Hurt			     |	JANET:  adrian@uk.ac.hw.cs
 UUCP: ..!ukc!cs.hw.ac.uk!adrian     |  ARPA:   adrian@cs.hw.ac.uk

The Traveller Mailing List is a courtesy of James Perkins and Tektronix, Inc.
All opinions and material above is the responsibility of the originator.
Send Submissions To: @RELAY.CS.NET:traveller@dadla.LA.TEK.COM,
	uunet!dadla.la.tek.com!traveller, or traveller@dadla.la.tek.com
List Administrator: traveller-request@dadla.la.tek.com

-------- TML Message #404 --------

Archive-Message-Number: 404
Date: Mon, 26 Jun 89 10:05 EDT
From: 09NILLES%CUA.BITNET@cornellc.cit.cornell.edu
Subject: meteor wpns


Subj:   Re: Nuclear Warfare in Space

>I've thought along similar lines as well. Find a small asteroid (say, a few
>100's of tonnes). Attach a power plant, manoeuvre drive and control system to
>it. Move it out of orbit, to a suitable distance, and let it head for the
>target world for 4 weeks at 1G (keep the drives cheap, simple and expendable).
>Resulting velocity = 10 x 4 x 7 x 24 x 60 x 60 = 0.24e8 m/sec. I'll let
>someone else add in any relativistic calculations. But the gear needed could be
>stuffed into an empty 50 tonne weapon bay on a cruiser.

I think you would be better off using the Bulk Cargo carrior in Fighting ships.
That way you could get that sucker going a good speed.  You then jump the ship
and meteor into the correct star system.  This way, you can be out of the
system before anyone even sees the meteor comming.  You simply cut the jump
cables once you enter the system.  Or if you have time, remove them for reuse.
You don't have to worry about sticking around and getting shot at while you
take the asteroid up to speed.  You do that in an already occupied parsect.
Admittedly, it is a more expensive way to enter the feild, but then again,
you can reuse the ship.  You also don't have to worry about the enemy comming
and taking over the asteroid while the engines are still emplaced.  Then
turning it to s new and safe trajectory.

> If anyone is interested, I'll dig out the figures from an old article
> on giant meteor strikes and convert the data to ship impacts on planets.

I'm interested.


David
09nilles@cua.bitnet

The Traveller Mailing List is a courtesy of James Perkins and Tektronix, Inc.
All opinions and material above is the responsibility of the originator.
Send Submissions To: @RELAY.CS.NET:traveller@dadla.LA.TEK.COM,
	uunet!dadla.la.tek.com!traveller, or traveller@dadla.la.tek.com
List Administrator: traveller-request@dadla.la.tek.com

-------- TML Message #405 --------

Archive-Message-Number: 405
From: (Be True to Your Song) baranski@yoda.enet.dec.COM
Date: 26 Jun 89 15:40
Subject: RE:  meteors vs. missles


The Problem with meteors is that they are very visible, and easily disrupted by
sufficient TL weapons, whereas a missle could easily have stealth capabilities
and be hardened.

Jim Baranski
DEC Tewksbury MA

The Traveller Mailing List is a courtesy of James Perkins and Tektronix, Inc.
All opinions and material above is the responsibility of the originator.
Send Submissions To: @RELAY.CS.NET:traveller@dadla.LA.TEK.COM,
	uunet!dadla.la.tek.com!traveller, or traveller@dadla.la.tek.com
List Administrator: traveller-request@dadla.la.tek.com

-------- TML Message #406 --------

Archive-Message-Number: 406
Date: Mon, 26 Jun 89 15:43:14 -0500
From: uxc.cso.uiuc.edu!zephyr.ENS.TEK.COM!gslisa!gsliss!jcunning@tektronix.TEK.COM
Subject: Laserburn & Asteroids





Someone just told me that Laserburn is still in business. He
is a miniatures nut, so I consider his info reliable.

As for asteroids as planet-killers, see Adventure 12,
Secret of the Ancients. Grandfather used asteroids which
were accelerated to near-light speeds through his portals
and then smashed into planets/. The impact then shattered them,
and created some new asteroid belts. This process was
Grandfather's ultimate weapon with which he fought his
Final War against his children, wiping all of them out.

How about that Lucan, eh? What a kooky guy.



				Jim Cunningham
				Traveller Relic



The Traveller Mailing List is a courtesy of James Perkins and Tektronix, Inc.
All opinions and material above is the responsibility of the originator.
Send Submissions To: @RELAY.CS.NET:traveller@dadla.LA.TEK.COM,
	uunet!dadla.la.tek.com!traveller, or traveller@dadla.la.tek.com
List Administrator: traveller-request@dadla.la.tek.com

-------- TML Message #407 --------

Archive-Message-Number: 407
Subject: Re: meteors vs. missles 
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 89 00:13:30 PDT
From: (Leonard Erickson) leonard@bucket.UUCP



>The Problem with meteors is that they are very visible, and easily disrupted by
>sufficient TL weapons, whereas a missle could easily have stealth capabilities
>and be hardened.
>
>Jim Baranski
>DEC Tewksbury MA

Sorry, but a small asteriod/large meteor is *not* very visible. The only way
to detect it is with active sensors as it won't have any emissions worth 
mentioning. You might say it is naturally stealthy. After all, it is just
a falling rock. Nothing special about it except the fact that its orbit
intersects that target's orbit at the time the target is there.

And just what TL weapon can *destroy* a chunk of nickel-iron a mile or
two in diameter? Breaking it up into pieces makes the problem *worse*
not better. You have to completely destroy it or deflect its course.
If you "break" it, the pieces will deliver just as much impact energy,
and more of it will wind up in the atmosphere (and thus mess up your
climate).

If we go for near-lightspeed projectiles, you won't be able to detect
them in time to stop them. After all, at .9c, something a billion miles
away will arrive less than 7 seconds after any possible detector message!
A billion miles is roughly the diameter of Jupiter's orbit. And at .9c
a projectile a few *meters* in diameter would be a world killer.

I can't see any practical defense. Luckily .9c is not easily attainable
even at high tech levels. But this type of overgrown kinetic-kill weapon
is a possible means of gravely unbalancing the balance of power.



The Traveller Mailing List is a courtesy of James Perkins and Tektronix, Inc.
All opinions and material above is the responsibility of the originator.
Send Submissions To: @RELAY.CS.NET:traveller@dadla.LA.TEK.COM,
	uunet!dadla.la.tek.com!traveller, or traveller@dadla.la.tek.com
List Administrator: traveller-request@dadla.la.tek.com

-------- TML Message #408 --------

Archive-Message-Number: 408
Date: 27 Jun 89 11:00 EDT
From: TIHOR@acf7.nyu.edu
Subject: Drop the Rock


In our group this is refered to as the Drop the Rock problem (after the
entertaining section of the C&S rules by that name.)  The only solution
we have come up with is that in a potentially hostile enviornment
(terrorists have access to starships, engines can accellerate at 1+G
for months) a system must maintain draconian control over all objects within
a large radius of its inhabited planets.

That means active scanning; passive scanning for energy emitted by
small objects impacting the near-lightspeed asteroid; etc.  The
radius must be large enough that the society can apply a large delta
V to the object in question, for example by partical beam, or kinetic
weapon of their own (remember the velocities roughly add in a colision.)

All together though its an arguement against the existance of life on planets
or other objects that can not dodge at least a few miles give a short notice.

- -------

The Traveller Mailing List is a courtesy of James Perkins and Tektronix, Inc.
All opinions and material above is the responsibility of the originator.
Send Submissions To: @RELAY.CS.NET:traveller@dadla.LA.TEK.COM,
	uunet!dadla.la.tek.com!traveller, or traveller@dadla.la.tek.com
List Administrator: traveller-request@dadla.la.tek.com

-------- TML Message #409 --------

Archive-Message-Number: 409
From: scratch@unix.cis.pittsburgh.edu (Steven J Owens)
Date: Mon, 26 Jun 89 21:49:08 EDT
Subject: RE:  meteors vs. missles


> The Problem with meteors is that they are very visible, and easily disrupted 
> sufficient TL weapons, whereas a missle could easily have stealth capabilitie
> and be hardened.

	Uhmmm... let me get this straight... a tiny cylinder of sophisticated
electronics can be "hardened" more than a huge lump of nickel-iron??
 
	Regardless, if the TL is high enough that the one side might have
weapons with enough brute force to virtually disintegrate the meteor (and
it would have to do so to prevent any damage.  Perhaps there would be less
direct damage from a shattered meteor, but the amount would still be 
considerable) then the other side would have sufficient resources to move
a truly massive meteor, making it just as difficult to destroy/divert as
the smaller meteor at lower TL.  
 
	Heck, if things are that high level, they could just hook up some
sort of stealth system to the meteor, or perhaps a black globe (think now,
with an entire meteor (and truly massive meteor at that) to act as a heat
sink, the black globe could absorb a heckuva lot of damage, and even before
that, the globe would enable the meteor to get much closer before detection.
Also, if the meteor is roughly spherical, and the globe is calibrated so
the outer edge is only a few feet out from the surface, it would be almost
impossible for enemy ship to land on the meteor.
 
	Of course, by that time you might as well get creative with your
TL18 devices, like linking a teleportation gate to the heart of a star,
and hooking the "output" end to a planet's atmosphere, or perhaps even
hooking several stars together to accelerate the aging process and cause
a spontaneous nova.  If that's too esoteric for your tastes, simply put
together a VERY powerful gravity generator (the size of the deathstar,
perhaps) able to survive solar temperature for a short (or even not so
short) length of time, then drop it into a star and turn on the gravity.
Bingo, instant disruption of the star's structure, resulting in something
similar enough to a nova to severely screw up the other side's control of 
a system... not that anybody would WANT the system after this has been done...

Steven J. Owens  |  Scratch@Pittvms  |  Scratch@unix.cis.pittsburgh.edu

"He knew how machinery moved, and this wasn't it.  All he could
 think of was a man and woman making love.  Slippery-smooth rythmic
 motion, absolute single-minded purpose, motion for the sake of motion.
 It was terrible in it's beauty, the flight of the horse."

	-- _The_Flight_of_the_Horse_, Larry Niven


The Traveller Mailing List is a courtesy of James Perkins and Tektronix, Inc.
All opinions and material above is the responsibility of the originator.
Send Submissions To: @RELAY.CS.NET:traveller@dadla.LA.TEK.COM,
	uunet!dadla.la.tek.com!traveller, or traveller@dadla.la.tek.com
List Administrator: traveller-request@dadla.la.tek.com

-------- TML Message #410 --------

Archive-Message-Number: 410
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 89 13:10:07 -0400
From: elturner@phoenix.princeton.edu (Edwin L Turner)
Subject: Re: meteors vs. missles


>Sorry, but a small asteriod/large meteor is *not* very visible. The only way  
>to detect it is with active sensors as it won't have any emissions worth      
>mentioning. You might say it is naturally stealthy. After all, it is just     
>a falling rock. Nothing special about it except the fact that its orbit       
>intersects that target's orbit at the time the target is there.               

Actually, they are reasonably strong infrared sources.  For example, the
recent NASA IRAS (Infrared Astronomy Satellite) survey managed to detected
several comets in the outer solar system (i.e., where they are just icy
bodies of roughly kilometer size and have not developed a coma or tail)
using technology which is well behind our current state of the art (since
it had to be frozen years in advance of the launch).

Also, it seems perfectly reasonable to assume that systems with advanced TL
worlds will employ active sensors to monitor all local traffic and use
computers to flag any objects on non-ballistic trajectories 
(i.e., accelerating) or with orbits which will carry them into high traffic
areas.

>And just what TL weapon can *destroy* a chunk of nickel-iron a mile or      
>two in diameter? Breaking it up into pieces makes the problem *worse*       
>not better. You have to completely destroy it or deflect its course.        
>If you "break" it, the pieces will deliver just as much impact energy,      
>and more of it will wind up in the atmosphere (and thus mess up your        
>climate).                                                                   

You are correct that breaking it up immediately outside the atmosphere will
do little, if any, good.  However, any weapon that breaks it up reasonably
violently (i.e., explosively) at a considerable distance will impart 
sufficient transverse velocity to nearly all of the fragments so as to
make them miss the target entirely.  The basic point is that planets are
quite small objects on interplanetary scales and very easy to miss.  For
example, imparting a transverse velocity of only 1 km/s to an object
previously moving toward the center of the Earth as it crosses the Moon's
orbit (very close!) is about sufficient to cause it to miss entirely;
further away, even smaller deflection velocities will suffice.  For
basicly the same reasons, deflection of the whole incoming object is far
easier (less energetically demanding) than putting it on a collision
course in the first place.

>If we go for near-lightspeed projectiles, you won't be able to detect       
>them in time to stop them. After all, at .9c, something a billion miles     
>away will arrive less than 7 seconds after any possible detector message!   
>A billion miles is roughly the diameter of Jupiter's orbit. And at .9c      
>a projectile a few *meters* in diameter would be a world killer.            

First of all, I make it to be more like 10 minutes than 7 seconds, but
in any case, you are now talking about a fundamentally different kind
of weapon.  Previously, we were discussing a weapon which derived its
energy primarily from its own mass and orbital velocities (i.e., basicly
the star's gravitational field) with the drive only supplying the
nudges needed to aim it at the target.  However, a .9c kinetic weapon
must derive nearly all of its energy from the drive itself which is
a very different situation.  If we control that much energy, there
will be many different ways to use it destructively.  For example, we can
use the drive itself (plus perhaps some stealth technology) as a missle.
The mass may be less but the velocity will be correspondingly increased
to deliver the same (actually more in the most reasonable case in which
the drive delivers a fixed thrust) kinetic energy.  Alternately, we
might be able to convert the drive's energy into an explosive form and
simply use it as a bomb.  Anyway, it is a whole different problem.

Ed Turner

The Traveller Mailing List is a courtesy of James Perkins and Tektronix, Inc.
All opinions and material above is the responsibility of the originator.
Send Submissions To: @RELAY.CS.NET:traveller@dadla.LA.TEK.COM,
	uunet!dadla.la.tek.com!traveller, or traveller@dadla.la.tek.com
List Administrator: traveller-request@dadla.la.tek.com

-------- End of TML Messages --------

